Claire and Kelly Conversation
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Kelly Duggan: [00:00:00] Welcome to The Love What You Do podcast. I'm Kelly Dugan, former HR executive, turned personal, brand expert, and career coach. And I'm here each episode sharing strategies to help you uncover your unique value, leverage your personal brand, and take action to create a career you love.
Thank you so much for coming back to The Love What You Do podcast today. We are so excited to welcome a very special guest. We have one of my great friends with us here today, Claire Harding. Uh, Claire is not only an incredible learning and development professional of which we're gonna dive into hearing all about her career today.
Um, but she is also a mom of three little boys. Uh, we [00:01:00] had the opportunity, Claire to. Meet and work together at WWE and just were a whole different type of tag team there. Um, and that's where we became really not only colleagues, but great friends as well. And, uh, I'm so excited to dive into your career story and hopefully.
You have some advice for working mothers like myself who are going to be very soon mothers. Um, I'd love to hear your perspective on all things career loving what you do, motherhood, because by the time this comes out, God willing, I will have my little one here with me already. So welcome to the podcast, Claire.
Claire Harding: Thank you. I'm very excited to join you and also very excited for you and all that is ahead.
Kelly Duggan: Oh, thank you so much. Thank you. And Claire, I've shared this with you before, but you are one of my favorite like working mom role models because I think you have just done such an [00:02:00] incredible job of balancing a real passion in what you do and a passion for motherhood and being able to bring those things together has been so inspiring to me when I think about like what I've always wanted my future to look like, uh, with a family and a career that I'm so passionate about.
So why don't we start with talking about your career journey and just how you've gotten where you are today as a director of learning and development.
Claire Harding: Yeah. Oh goodness. That's very kind of you. Um, certainly has been a work of trial and error, uh, over the last close to a decade, I guess probably. I've been at least pregnant, uh, and along for the journey for almost a decade now.
Kelly Duggan: Oh my gosh.
Claire Harding: so yeah, I. My path to learning and development was not necessarily linear. I went to college for city and regional planning.
Uh, so I
Kelly Duggan: I [00:03:00] don't think I probably knew that at some point, but I did not realize that. Oh my gosh.
Claire Harding: yeah. Yeah.
Kelly Duggan: Yeah. And this is why what you majored in college doesn't define what you do with your career path.
Claire Harding: Yeah, certainly it gave me a very valuable skillset, but, uh, that I use every day, but not necessarily in the profession I thought I would be in coming out of college. Um, what put me on the path to learning and development was my first experience, uh, professional experience out of college. Uh, I applied to and participated in a program that was super popular, um, around that time called Teach for America.
So Teach for America is a program that takes folks who did not major in education and, and don't necessarily have an education background and, uh, puts them on a quick ramp up to be a classroom teacher. Uh, so a very short of [00:04:00] training. And then you go into a classroom and you're the, the teacher of record there.
So that is my very first foray into teaching and learning was in a classroom teaching six year olds.
Kelly Duggan: Oh my gosh.
Claire Harding: I will, I still say that it was the hardest job I had, uh, you know, close to, I guess close to 20 years later, I would still mark that one as, as the hardest. Um, but one that I learned an incredible amount from,
Kelly Duggan: Hmm.
Claire Harding: uh, following, being in the classroom directly. I started working for Teach for America. I was with them for close to 10 years, um, and a really fast-paced environment. Um. Always on kind of the cutting edge of learning. We were always trying to think about ways to train our teachers better, to have students, have more positive learning experiences. Um, really the spirit there was one of [00:05:00] continual learning and improvement. Um, and that really, I think was a really good fit for me.
Kelly Duggan: Mm-hmm.
I
Claire Harding: love the opportunities to build things, think critically about structures, processes and how we improve them. So I learned a whole lot, uh, while I was there. And it was actually in, um, the last role I had there where I welcomed my first child. I, I feel like I was very thoughtful. I spread out all three of my children across three employers. Um, so
Kelly Duggan: There.
Claire Harding: to take, take three maternity leaves from me. Um, but I, I had my first baby there. Um, and, and it was a really positive experience for me. Um, it was one, you know, that. I, I actually, in thinking about this topic, I was like, I, I actually feel like I've lost a little bit of memory of like where I [00:06:00] was at, um, mentally. I do know I was a little burned out,
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: might say, uh, the environment, while it was incredibly beneficial for everything I learned along the way, it certainly was. Intense.
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: and I think one of, one of the most intense periods of time at Teach for America, as you can imagine, is right before school starts.
Kelly Duggan: Yes.
Claire Harding: those months of July, August, September are really tough because we're trying to do everything we can to get the teachers that we're working with ready for of school and, uh, make sure they have everything that they need. And, um, I was due August 6th.
Kelly Duggan: Oh my goodness.
Claire Harding: and if I'm being honest, some of like the memories that I have of anticipating maternity leave, I was like very happy. I was like, oh, [00:07:00] finally I have like a, meaningful enough excuse to, uh, you know tone down my professional pursuits. Like it
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: it wasn't just like, oh God, this is really hard and I, you know, wanna take vacation. I was like, no, I'm having a baby. So this is like a real legitimate reason that I can
Kelly Duggan: Take my foot off the gas. Yeah,
Claire Harding: Yes.
Kelly Duggan: yeah.
Claire Harding: and I think I sort of went into maternity leave with that mindset. Um, and I, I will say I think I got pretty lucky. Um, my first baby was, he was a very good baby who's probably the best in the baby phase of
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: Uh. So it was, again, this is probably, I'm probably not recalling all the details as they truly were, but from where I am now, I, I recall, you know, it being really lovely and you know, the time of year I had him, it was, you know, I was on maternity leave August, September and October, which, uh, for the area that [00:08:00] we are in is like just a beautiful time of year.
So
Kelly Duggan: Oh yeah.
I could go
Claire Harding: on walks. And I was lucky enough to have a close friend who was on maternity leave at the same time, and we would meet up and take the babies on walks. And, so it actually, uh, for me that first experience was a little bit of a breather. I know, you know, certainly I'm not promoting the idea that maternity leave is a vacation.
It is not
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: Um, but for me, it was a chance to slow down.
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: professionally.
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: yeah, I, I transitioned, I, I forget how old he was. He was probably one or one and a half when I, there was just a lot of change happening. Um, in my current role. I'd felt like I'd really attained uh, professional level there that I could on or, and maybe was looking for something a little bit. Um. [00:09:00] Less intense.
Kelly Duggan: Hmm.
Claire Harding: and I moved on to a, a really small nonprofit in the area. Um, I moved with every intention of wanting to have another baby. I remember asking about that in the interview and trying to be very forthcoming that, know, that was in my plans. I wasn't pregnant at the time or, or anything like that, but. I remember that being a factor in my decision making was how do I, you know, will this benefit exist? Uh, teach for America, you know, for the time it was a, a good maternity leave. I wanted something comparable.
Kelly Duggan: Mm-hmm.
Claire Harding: I spent a couple of years there. That's where I had my second baby. So employer, uh, took another maternity leave. That it was a really phenomenal program that I worked for, but I realized quickly that I, I loved being in a bigger organization where there was [00:10:00] more opportunity for learning, more opportunity for collaboration. And so that's when I, uh, made the switch into the corporate world and where our paths crossed,
Kelly Duggan: Yes.
Claire Harding: and transitioned to working in the corporate space in learning and development. Uh, for WWE and a few years in there I welcomed my third.
Kelly Duggan: Yeah. Very nice.
Claire Harding: where I've been.
Kelly Duggan: Yeah. And take me back to if that moment when you started with Teach for America, because I think that that's a really pivotal switch that you made from the plan you thought you were going to have. And that seems to have really triggered a chain reaction to an entirely different career path that you've ended up following.
Um, did you, did you have an inkling that that was going to happen at the time, or did you think Teach for America was gonna be a stop on a longer [00:11:00] journey?
Claire Harding: Gosh, that's a great question. I don't know if I was thinking that far ahead.
Kelly Duggan: Yeah,
Claire Harding: Um, I realized in
Kelly Duggan: I.
Claire Harding: when I think about my college experience, I don't know that I really fully understood the breadth of professional and possibilities that were out there.
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: uh, my background, my parents are, you know, my mom's a nurse, you know, my dad, uh, did Labor union organizing, you know?
Kelly Duggan: Mm-hmm.
Claire Harding: and, and that was kind of their circle. I don't, I don't think I fully understood the expanse of things you could do as a professional. And so I. know, I was, I was very motivated in college and, and knew things in the social sector were interesting to me. So Teach for America was a very natural fit there. Um, it was a program that I really believed in, in terms [00:12:00] of equity and education and, that was a very meaningful role for me. Um. The transition into learning and development on the corporate side, I think is the unexpected twist. Um, because I, I got into teaching of some social beliefs I had, you know, uh, really that, you know, purpose of the organization, whereas. Now, I'm not necessarily working for a mission driven,
Kelly Duggan: Mm-hmm.
Claire Harding: in the corporate sector, but I am tapping into what I hope everybody, even in a corporate setting gets to experience at work, which is that they have a job, they love. That they feel challenged and supported. Um, 'cause I feel like I've been able to find that in my professional [00:13:00] journey. And so through learning and development and coaching and, and things that an employer can provide for their employees, like that's my hope, um, that I can contribute that to whatever professional environment I'm in.
Kelly Duggan: Oh, I love that. And I, I love that you have found this way to take the kernel of what you loved of teaching and apply it in so many different environments and then end up in more of this corporate space. Um, but your why is still there because it's. Pretty much the same reason you liked working for Teach for America, it sounds like, like that has has stayed with you even though the environments have shifted drastically.
Claire Harding: Yeah, and I think, you know, for me. My why has probably shifted over time a bit and, and shifted depending on the environment I'm in. But you know, the topic of like, how do you balance motherhood and a [00:14:00] career? Um, I have no answers. Like that's, uh, like I I talking to you not with answers, but just with experiences.
And I think for me, one of the. Things I lean on is that I do really love what I do, um, and I wanna keep doing that. I enjoy the opportunity to work with the colleagues I work with and, work on projects that are new and stretch me and make me feel like I am learning and growing all the time. Like that's definitely one of my, um, core things that I look for in a role is the ability to do that. and I think that's what has allowed me to try to balance these two experiences is because I try to approach my work from a place of purpose and like I like, I like helping [00:15:00] people. And at the core of what I do, that is still there.
Kelly Duggan: I really love that because I think one of the things that has been a unique experience for me being. Being pregnant and even in, as you know, Claire, on a three year journey of trying to get to the point of, of, of being, bringing a baby into the world. Um, it's been a constant thought of on my mind of like, okay, how is everything going to shift and change when I get to the point of being a mother?
And I think one of the things for me that I've really had to face it and, and understand of is I've been a very career driven person and I so relate to what you mentioned about, um, kind of preparing for that first maternity leave and thinking through like, oh, I finally have something big enough to step away and what I take from that and, and tell me if this is, uh, if this resonates with how you feel. [00:16:00] It's almost, it's not that like anybody has ever tied me to my work. It's from me. Like it takes something that big for, for me to be like, you know what, like this is more important. This is where I'm going to shift my focus.
And for someone who's really career driven, um, and then feeling this like pull to something different, uh, it's. It's a life changing experience. I'm finding, and I haven't even gotten to the motherhood piece of this yet, but even just deciding that that's how you wanna move forward and, um, becoming pregnant and, and knowing that this is coming, uh, I can definitely resonate to what you shared there around like, wow.
Yeah, this is the, this is the first thing that's been big enough that I, I wanna prioritize it, you know, even for over my, my career for, for a while. Yeah.
Claire Harding: Yeah. Yeah. My
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: I remember one time, um, my mom always says great advice.
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: I was like, really upset about something that had happened at work. Like, I just, [00:17:00] I, I, I don't even remember what it was, which is, goes to show you. Um, but I was really upset and I was like crying to her and. She was like, you need a hobby. Um, and I remember her saying that basically she was like, all your eggs are in your work basket, so when work goes sideways for you, like you don't have that balanced with other pursuits. Um, and that was, I think true. I I don't have any significant hobbies. Um.
Kelly Duggan: I'll be the first to tell you I don't have hobbies. I,
Claire Harding: And that was like self-imposed, right? Like I
Kelly Duggan: yeah,
Claire Harding: be successful at work. I wanted to have this. Um, so in StrengthsFinder, whatever, one of my top strengths, which is definitely a double-edged sword, is responsibility, right? Like, so I wanna be perceived as reliable, helpful, um, [00:18:00] these kind of words that. me, somebody proves that by being always available and, you know, uh, I fed into that for sure, uh, and very much, yeah, the having a child felt like the first time I could like, let myself off the hook or like, um, not impose that, uh, on myself because I was like, no, this is like, I, and I will say like, um. You know, now I think one of the questions people ask working moms a lot is like, how do you balance it? Like, well, like my kids' daycare closes at 5:30. Like I'll be fined if I don't pick them up at five 30. Like I have to leave work like. There's, there's no choice. There's no like, oh, I could stay and finish this project.
I can't. I have to go home.
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: They have to be picked up, they have to be fed, they have to be bathed, they have to be put to bed. and so some of that actually, I feel [00:19:00] like less existential of like, how do you balance it, but more it's just the day-to-day reality that, uh, they need to be taken care of. And, and for me. I think approach and I, I don't think this was like an intentional or thoughtful approach, but I think what I've sort of, the groove I find myself in is being comfortable that like, sometimes work gets prioritized, right? Like I was just talking to you. I have a lot of things that I wanna work on and I'm probably gonna ask my husband, you know, like, Hey, you know, can we work something, you know, Sunday I wanna go to the library and work all day, not all day, but. Some of the day.
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: so sometimes I'm gonna put time for work ahead of time with my kids, um, and sometimes I'm gonna put time with my kids ahead of work. Like this afternoon I'm going into my kindergartner's class to do like a craft project. Like, so I, I
Kelly Duggan: [00:20:00] So much fun.
Claire Harding: for me, what has allowed me to feel fulfilled,
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: in both categories.
Kelly Duggan: And so how have you navigated finding environments that support those priorities for you?
Claire Harding: Uh,
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: it, it was luck, like, and you know. At Teach for America. You know, that was my first experience, um, going into motherhood. My manager at the time, there was a mom herself, and I think for me was really a role model. She, um, was both wonderful manager and team leader and a wonderful mom to her kids. Um. I think is probably why I didn't go into my maternity leave with that much fear.
Kelly Duggan: Mm-hmm.
Claire Harding: I actually think like even [00:21:00] though the environment at WWE was supportive, like we worked with, there were a lot of other, um, moms on our team. I actually think that was probably the maternity leave I was most worried about.
Uh, and when I, I think back, so at Teach for America, I'd kind of reached a role that was more senior in the organization. I felt like I'd kind of accomplished a lot of my professional goals at Teach for America. And then when I pivoted into the corporate sector, I kind of had to take a step back. I was sort of, uh, I shifted into maybe a more junior role than I had been, um, in earlier parts of my career. And so when I had my last baby, I actually was really still trying to.
Kelly Duggan: Accomplish.
Claire Harding: Accomplish professional goals and, and, um, you know, I'd, when I had my first baby, I'd been at that organization for like eight years. At that [00:22:00] point, I'd proven
Kelly Duggan: Hmm.
Claire Harding: to be reliable. Um, whereas at, at, um, WWE I still wanted to make sure that it was visible to everyone, that I could still be reliable and accountable and responsible. Um. Even having that now, that's,
Kelly Duggan: Mm-hmm.
Claire Harding: I, for all of my children, I never, uh, worked over maternity leave like that was, uh, I've heard stories of people being like, oh, like my boss would message me.
Kelly Duggan: Oh Oh my gosh. Yeah.
That's kinda wild
Claire Harding: to me. I was very fortunate to never have that pressure to be. On, um, like I, I fully took my, my maternity leave for myself and my kids.
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: so that was, was really, you know, I recognize that that's not the experience that everybody does have.
Kelly Duggan: Mm-hmm.
Claire Harding: everybody [00:23:00] should have that like
Kelly Duggan: Yeah,
Claire Harding: That
Kelly Duggan: it's this important time.
Claire Harding: a protected time for a reason. Um, and right now I'm at an employer that, is continually expanding their parental leaves and, you know, making sure that there's equity and parental leave for, um, you know, different, different parents.
Um. So it's, it's been interesting also to watch the shift in leave policies over the last decade. Um.
Kelly Duggan: Oh yeah. There's been so, so much change, um, in, in that field in particular, but I. One, when you shared your feelings around kind of going into your third maternity leave and being at a completely different point in your career versus your, um, first two maternity leave experiences. I think that is something a lot of women probably relate to around feeling.[00:24:00]
There's no, there's no perfect time, right? And when you're at a point where you are. Really like accelerating with your career and also feeling the drive to motherhood and, and wanting, wanting both things simultaneously. You know, how, how did you manage that internal pressure and, and stress during that time?
And, um, like what, what was that experience like for you?
Claire Harding: Yeah, I think I'm still like working through that very much. I, uh, part of it was the environment. Um, but I like experienced a lot of promotions early in my career, so I, I was promoted quickly. I took on lots of responsibility quickly, um, you know, was leading teams. And I enjoyed that. I liked, like I said, like I'm very driven by learning new things.
I [00:25:00] liked the continuous challenge of filling, um, bigger roles and learning how to do things in a new way. Um, and when I think about the last 10 years, like if, if you look at my titles like I've mostly been stagnant for and stagnant. Maybe I shouldn't use the word stagnant. I'll use steady,
Kelly Duggan: Oh, I love, I love that reframe. Yeah.
Claire Harding: or for the last, you know, five years.
Um, and maybe not intentionally, but I think just a matter of the realities, I've been okay with that.
Kelly Duggan: Mm-hmm.
Claire Harding: and I think that my 25-year-old self probably would not have been as okay with that. Um, but I'm okay with it because it's what's necessary for me to be able to balance both things.
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: and I think everybody has to find [00:26:00] what works for them.
Some like. I would be lying if I didn't say sometimes I wish my career was moving faster and that I, you know, had ascended into higher levels of leadership. By this point in my career, I also sometimes, like I. like, I wish I didn't have to go to work today and that I could grocery shopping not at 9:30 at night, but I could go grocery shopping at 11:00 AM. Um, so I, I feel the pulls in both directions and for me, I think it has been just about finding that middle ground. Um, I go back to, uh, when we were at WWE we hosted a panel of women leaders at WWE speaking to our, um. You know, women's group. And I I remember one of the panelists saying basically like that there are times in your career that you're gonna put on the gas and, and times you might take your foot off. I, I don't think I'm taking my foot off, but [00:27:00] I am hopeful that, you know, me being in five, 10 years when my kids are. Fully out of diapers, uh, getting themselves dressed, brushing their teeth,
Kelly Duggan: Yep.
Claire Harding: into the phase where they probably don't want a whole lot to do with me. maybe I do take on a bigger role, um, and, and have that, but I. I right now, I'm not in a rush
Kelly Duggan: Yeah,
Claire Harding: there. I feel
Kelly Duggan: I.
lucky
Claire Harding: to be in a role that is still very professionally fulfilling allows me to not feel like I'm shortchanging my kids by, by any stretch of the imagination. I.
Kelly Duggan: I, I absolutely love that perspective because, I mean, there's a reason that this podcast is called Love What You Do and Not Love Your Job, because we are so, there's so many pieces of what we do every day, and it's impossible to show up in every aspect. A hundred percent. It [00:28:00] that that's 5000% right, that we don't have 5000%.
Um, but I think one of the things that I am training my mindset for as I move forward is like. I have to just give my life a hundred percent. And that's, that's gonna mean different things every single day. Right? Like, and, um, I think you have really walked that walk, uh, in, in a, in a really amazing way. And I, I think I thank you for just sharing that perspective and that that vulnerability around, um, it's not, it's not an easy thing to navigate, uh, but it's a really fulfilling thing to navigate at the same time.
Claire Harding: I am going to remember that statement, um, when I am feeling in those moments of frustration. 'cause I, I should, I, I really like that perspective of looking at the totality of what you do.
Kelly Duggan: Yeah,
I
Claire Harding: certainly still sometimes find myself equating my value to my professional, role. Uh, I [00:29:00] really like that. Love what you do.
Kelly Duggan: there Because you do a lot, my friend. Like you do so much. Yeah. You know. I know, I do think that is, um, that's. Again, that's a mindset that I have that I'm, I'm praying I'm able to uphold and keep when I am in the trenches right. Of, of, of motherhood And why it's so good to have role models, uh, like you and the amazing women I've gotten to work with over the years who are mothers and, um, all have had very different experiences.
But at the same time, I think the, the core of all of these experiences are very similar. I think we, we share. Very unique perspectives of, of what this, what the, the future looks like. Right. So what advice do you have for, you know, someone who might be getting ready to start their first maternity leave and or maybe preparing to enter [00:30:00] reenter after a maternity leave?
Um, as a veteran at this, at this point, what, what advice would you give?
Claire Harding: Great question. Um, I think one, I think you have a, a great head on your shoulders to navigate it. Um. And I think you've created something really special for you that like you're walking into motherhood, um, in a professional pursuit that you've worked really hard for as well. So I think that's
Kelly Duggan: really exciting.
Claire Harding: Thank you.
I would say I feel like maybe the best advice is to do it your own way, like, um, to think about what matters most. To you and feel okay leaning into that, aside
Kelly Duggan: Hmm.
Claire Harding: uh, the, the noise that I think a lot of times we get from [00:31:00] social media or the influencing, uh, foray of people,
Kelly Duggan: Yes.
Claire Harding: have opinions about, you know, uh. What does being a working mother look like? What does being a stay at home mother look like? And, and, um, all those different perceptions. But I think for me it's been about what works for me and what I want. Um, I want a career. Um, I want to also be a really present mom who, I don't get my kids off the bus every day, but I get them off the bus some days. Uh, and for me that's a really nice balance. Um. And I, I also know that like I wanted my kids to have a working mom. Like I, I, that's what I had growing up and I think it taught me some good lessons along the way. And so for, I. each of us finding what it is that gives us fulfillment trying to [00:32:00] create that in our professional lives.
And I, I realize that, you know, some people, depending on your current job or where you find yourself, um, you don't always have the ability to lean into that. But I think trying within what's in your sphere of influence to create, um, what is meaningful to you and, and if that means, you know. Um, shifting or, or changing roles or, you know, I think that's important.
So feel like you are, I feel like you've set that path in motion for yourself, a bit of knowing how much time you want to be able to devote to being there for your, your children, and. You know, being a mom, I feel like you've actually set your plan in motion already, which is really cool and exciting to
Kelly Duggan: Thank.
Claire Harding: um, yeah, and, and coming back for maternity leave, [00:33:00] uh, there's, you just
Kelly Duggan: It's a ride.
Claire Harding: It, you just gotta do it. Like I remember, I remember, uh, I don't remember. Again, I, I feel like I just have these like very specific, um, memories. I remember in my first job or my first maternity leave coming back, I was pumping the like, glamorous world of.
Pumping
Kelly Duggan: Yes. Navigating. Yeah.
Claire Harding: pumping milk in a like side office.
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: and at the time there were these modelo pumps and I, I lived about an hour away from where I worked.
Kelly Duggan: Wow.
Claire Harding: so I would drop, um, my son off at daycare. I would get in the car and I would drive. And manela at the time was the pump I used and it had probably like six parts. One of them was this little part that was about this big, it's like the little white flange. pump doesn't work without this little [00:34:00] tiny
Kelly Duggan: Oh my gosh.
Claire Harding: And wouldn't, you know, I forgot it. Like I left it at home and I just like, that's like one of these like memories I have of being like, what? And I have to go home.
Kelly Duggan: Oh my gosh.
Claire Harding: I.
Kelly Duggan: one little flange took you down for the day.
Claire Harding: First here. and I had to go home and drive home based on one stupid little piece of quarter inch rubber, uh, that I had not brought with me that day. Um, so it's, it's stuff like that, like now I can laugh at it. Um.
Kelly Duggan: I am sure that was there. There's probably not a ton of laughing on that drive home though.
Claire Harding: Yeah. No, no. Just like pure annoyance, right? Like having to
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: meeting I was supposed to be in and reschedule it or
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: all that good stuff.
Kelly Duggan: But I, that is such a perfect example of like the lack of control we [00:35:00] actually have over all things, right? Like. And I think, I mean, I am expecting, um, that motherhood is that on steroids, right? Like, and we do our best, but there's just, as my grandmother used to say, circumstances alter cases, right?
Like you're like, okay, we're changing plans now over something that really annoys me, like.
Claire Harding: It's, uh, yes. I, I say that to my kids. Uh, this is actually a line that I got from a close friend of co, from college. we were talking about just like, like, it's hard. Like it's hard. I. Now, like in the mornings I'm trying to get three small children ready and out the door. Certainly my physical appearance, what I show up to work looking like has changed.
Um, that's another podcast in itself, but like it, trying to get everything ready and together. Um, and she uses a line with her kids that I've tried to adopt of like, I'm doing my [00:36:00] best. So I try to tell my kids that, right? 'cause in the morning they'll be like, where's my shoe? Where's my, who knows,
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: anything you name it that they're looking for, know, 30 seconds before the bus is coming down the street. Um, and I say I'm doing my best and one person and I'm doing my best. 'cause that's, of that is internal talk,
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: to tell myself I'm doing my best, but also to model for them, right? Like, all we can ever do is our best. Um.
Kelly Duggan: Oh my gosh, Claire, I love that.
Claire Harding: finding the humor in it. I just mentioning the bus, I'll recall my very first day home from the hospital with Thomas.
Thomas is our third, uh, the bus stops right outside our house. Like literally the bus stop is our driveway. My two older children missed the bus that day. Like,
Kelly Duggan: Oh no.
Claire Harding: he'd like [00:37:00] it, it wasn't that hard to get them to the bus stop. Uh, and you just like, oh, luckily, uh, I had a partner who had parental leave.
The two of us still could not get the other two. Uh, I wasn't alone, uh, in trying to get them out to the bus. And just finding the humor in it and I think. Telling myself, I'm always just trying to do my best. Um, and finding that balance, but also modeling for my kids. Like
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: they had to wear dirty clothes to school because I didn't do the laundry last night because, you know what I did instead, I made a PowerPoint, like, right, like,
Kelly Duggan: Yeah. Yeah.
Claire Harding: trade offs and, and they're like, oh, again, you didn't do the laundry again.
I was like, no. Didn't get to it. Like, sorry,
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: you wanna wear those.
Kelly Duggan: Yeah,
Claire Harding: leggings that they love. If you wanna wear those, you gotta grab 'em out of the laundry bin.
Kelly Duggan: yeah.
Claire Harding: sorry. Um, but I'm okay with that 'cause I actually [00:38:00] think, those are some lessons that I them to have.
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: and that's just kind of the, the parenting that works for me
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: now.
Kelly Duggan: Some of my favorite childhood memories and like most poignant childhood memories and my mom will laugh at this, are of like those frenetic mornings before school of like the, the, where you're just everyone is doing their best to get out the door and, um. Just some of the funniest family stories that I have are of those mornings of like my mom having to drive me to the bus stop because I like it.
That was not that far. We lived in a neighborhood, you know, like all of those little things and like racing to catch that bus and, and making it. And just, I, I often, as I'm kind of moving into this era of motherhood, just think about those little moments that probably as the mom feels so stressful, but like.
When you think back on them as the kid, it's a totally different experience.
Claire Harding: Yeah,[00:39:00]
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: um. It's, it's a journey and you take it day by day. And I, I think maybe the other piece of advice is like, uh, when we were initially talking about this podcast, it was like, you know, like advice. And I was like, oh, I feel like I, I didn't really have a plan. And I actually think that maybe that was the best way to do it.
I didn't have a plan. I didn't have a, a plan for how I was gonna come back from maternity leave. I, I didn't have a birth plan. I. Like, and I'm a planner, like, so I, I feel like some people hear that and they're like, oh yeah, like, like, I'm a planner, I like a plan. I've, um, but I've been really okay letting things come, um, as they are, I mean, again, some days better than others, uh, but
Kelly Duggan: That's the best though. And like two things that I'm taking away from this podcast [00:40:00] conversation, Claire, is, um, number one. Doing it your way. Right. And I think that for, I, I completely resonate. Like you can have the best laid plans and God's gonna work it out his own way anyway. So like, there's only, there's only so many plans I think you can have going into something this life changing.
Um, but also. The choices that you make in motherhood, in your career, in all things are your choices to make. And once you've made that choice and you feel like you've made it in an authentic way, putting those blinders on and just like keep moving forward and being really confident and that you're doing the thing that's important to you and someone else is gonna do the thing that's important to them.
And trying not to compare, I think is, um. That, and I'm doing my best. I'm stealing that line. I'm, I'm stealing that line now because let me tell you, being 30, almost eight weeks pregnant, walking around, like sometimes just getting makeup on is doing my best that day.
Claire Harding: [00:41:00] Yes, you beat me.
Kelly Duggan: Oh my goodness. Not at all. Not at all. Well, thank you so much.
Claire Harding: excited for you. Um,
Kelly Duggan: Oh, thank you.
Claire Harding: you've both. Birthed a professional pursuit and aspiration you've had and now a new human to, to join the, your place at the top team. Um, I'm just really, really excited for you and
Kelly Duggan: Thank you so much, Claire.
Claire Harding: It, it's a, it's a beautiful, taxing,
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: funny
Kelly Duggan: Adventure. I love it. I love it. I'm so, I, I would love to be able to revisit this conversation like six months, a year from now. Um. Yeah, we are, we're definitely gonna do that. And just talk through, you know, how perspectives shift, because I'm under no delusions that I am in, I kind of equate this to starting a business in a lot of ways.
And like [00:42:00] you have this beautiful ignorance in the beginning of like, I could do this, like it, and, and you can, like, I, you absolutely can do it. But you probably wouldn't if you knew everything you were gonna have to go through in order to do it. Um, so I'm really like, I, I'm so excited for how this is going to shape and change my, me as a human, you know, uh, going on this, um.
Amazing vocational journey. Um, it, it's gonna change everything and I can't even, I, I can't even pretend to know that I know what that's gonna look like six months to a year from now. So we definitely have to get back and, and have this conversation again.
Claire Harding: Yeah. And I think like it changes everything. And yet, um, I'd like to hope that I'm still like
Kelly Duggan: You,
Claire Harding: me,
Kelly Duggan: yeah.
Claire Harding: Like, um, there's sort of this beautiful part of motherhood where like, yes, I. It changes all the cards in some ways, [00:43:00] and you're still, you um, all the i, all the research of like fetal cells getting into your bloodstream, I always find fascinating.
But,
Kelly Duggan: Oh my gosh. I know. I think about that all the
Claire Harding: can,
Kelly Duggan: time.
Claire Harding: if you can find a way to, to still do what you love and, and work it around your other new pursuits and new priorities.
Kelly Duggan: Yeah.
Claire Harding: what I.
Kelly Duggan: I actually, I love when you just said like the cards change, but it's still you holding the cards, right? Like, it's like still you navigating all of this and, um, your core. I mean, I can't make it through a podcast without talking about unique value like that, like the, the core of who you are is still there, just in a completely new and exciting way.
Um, but yeah, I, I, I completely hear you. Claire, thank you so much for joining us on this podcast today. I'm, I'm gonna hold us to kind of regrouping down, down the line. We can [00:44:00] just kinda chat about this even more so, but, um, I, this was incredibly helpful for me and I'm sure. For a, a lot of women out there who are in similar positions right now.
Um, and I, I just thank you so much for taking the time to join us.
Claire Harding: Thanks Kelly.
Kelly Duggan: Of course. Thanks for joining me on today's episode. As always, if you're looking for coaching support or would like to submit a question, you can drop me an email at info at your [email protected]. And if you enjoy today's episode, don't forget to subscribe, share, and leave a review so this podcast can find its way to other amazing listeners just like you.
